CTGJ Presents: Encyclopedia Cythera



  • (url="http://"http://homepage.mac.com/abryce/.Public/cythera/index.htm")http://homepage.mac....thera/index.htm(/url)

    From this URL you can travel to the various areas of the CTGJ website, to do reaserch for TSes, crons, or just for fun.

    You can also acess the archive of maps from CTGJ issues, and read the issues as well.
    It should be updated frequently and I'll inform you of new info put into it here.

    Let me know what you think.

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    I'll just put a random number at 0008EC and see what happens.
    (Famous Last Words #-32767)

    Where do you want to (url="http://"http://www.macclassics.com/cythera/tricks/rJade.htm")teleport(/url) today?



  • 1. It uses the <font> tag.

    2. The image at the main page that attempts to look like stone looks like a two year old took some crayons and scribbled in a confined area.

    3. There are lots of spelling and grammar errors. One example is that you spelled plague as P-L-A-U-G-E. And you used the abbreviated 'it is' (it's) in the place of the possessive word -- its -- in a couple of the pages.

    4. How much does this actually have to do with Cythera?

    5. There is far too much whitespace.

    6. What the heck are the tags / arguments 'X-CLARIS-USEIMAGEWIDTH,' 'X-CLARIS-WINDOW,' 'X-CLARIS-TAGVIEW,' and 'X-CLARIS-USEIMAGEHEIGHT'?

    7. It uses JavaScript.

    8. There are no links back to the main page.

    9. What's with all the <p>nbsp;</p> lines? <br> creates a line break, and that is all that is needed. There is no need for a blank <p></p> tag with whitespace in it, anyways.

    <edit: Grr. I can't put the & in front of nbsp; -- otherwise it will show whitespace. You'll have to imagine it.>

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    YakKa Foob MoG. GRuG
    PubbuWuP ZiNk WattooM
    GaZoRK. CHuMBLE SpuZz.

    (This message has been edited by Lord Gwydion (edited 02-23-2002).)



  • It needs work, but I think it is a great idea.

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    luck is beating the odds, bad luck is when they are the odds of having something bad happen to you.



  • Quote

    Originally posted by Lord Gwydion:
    **< Snip>
    **

    (1) There's nothing wrong with that.
    (2) It isn't intended to look like stone. Perhaps you ought to support you're local lenscrafters, rather than waste your time making inflamitory statements.

    (3) Yes, this is the only vald issue you've mentioned.

    (4) :rolleyes: For crying out loud...

    (5) Okay, but this sounds like a style issue to me. I'll look into it, perhaps a tasteful background would be in order.

    (6) From the GUI HTML editor I use for much of the work. Only people to have nothing better than to creep around in a page's HTML so as to think up technical-sounding things to whine about see it anyway.

    (7) Uh, what are you, a Microsoft crone?
    Besides, the Javascript is used in a way that is not mission critical, if you disable Javascript you aren't going to miss out on much.

    (8) Who Would want to go back to the 'Hello Newbie, if you're looking for CTGJ look here' screen? All it's functions are duplicated on the side bar, anyway.

    (9) See answer 6, second part.

    ------------------
    I'll just put a random number at 0008EC and see what happens.
    (Famous Last Words #-32767)

    Where do you want to (url="http://"http://www.macclassics.com/cythera/tricks/rJade.htm")teleport(/url) today?



  • Quote

    Originally posted by SuperNova:
    **It needs work, but I think it is a great idea.
    **

    A little vauge, but well balanced comment. You're right, it does need some work.
    Oh, and Gwdy - I'd like to share a little constructive criticism of my own - you're a whinier. No offense intended, just my opinion.

    ------------------
    I'll just put a random number at 0008EC and see what happens.
    (Famous Last Words #-32767)

    Where do you want to (url="http://"http://www.macclassics.com/cythera/tricks/rJade.htm")teleport(/url) today?



  • Quote

    Originally posted by Bryce:
    (1) There's nothing wrong with that.
    Yes there is. The <font> tag isn't an actual HTML tag.

    (2) It isn't intended to look like stone. Perhaps you ought to support you're local lenscrafters, rather than waste your time making inflamitory statements.
    It most certainly looks exactly like a poor attempt to look like granite or somesuch. What is it intended to look like, then?

    (3) Yes, this is the only vald issue you've mentioned.
    How are the other issues 'in valid '?

    (4):rolleyes: For crying out loud...
    I see absolutely no relevancy to the game Cythera, and yet the word 'Cythera' is pasted all over the entire site.

    (5) Okay, but this sounds like a style issue to me. I'll look into it, perhaps a tasteful background would be in order.
    The white background is fine, but there is just way too much area between the top bar and the title text and the main text -- if you just remove a few of the lines of whitespace it will look better.

    (6) From the GUI HTML editor I use for much of the work. Only people to have nothing better than to creep around in a page's HTML so as to think up technical-sounding things to whine about see it anyway.
    If you don't know what the tag does then you should take it out. It's silly to do otherwise, especially since no browsers will recognise the arguments/tags.

    (7) Uh, what are you, a Microsoft crone?
    Huh?

    Besides, the Javascript is used in a way that is not mission critical, if you disable Javascript you aren't going to miss out on much.
    JavaScript shouldn't be included in any good web page. The only scripting languages put on web pages, in my opinion, are server-side ones -- Perl, PHP, et cetera. And why do you have it on there in the first place?

    (8) Who Would want to go back to the 'Hello Newbie, if you're looking for CTGJ look here' screen? All it's functions are duplicated on the side bar, anyway.
    Having no link to the main page is simply very bad style -- the user has to instead type in 'index.htm' (it should by .html, by the way -- this isn't the ancient UNIX that doesn't allow file extensions longer than three characters, and /.Public/cythera/ will automatically go to index.html when you type in that URL) manually.

    ------------------
    YakKa Foob MoG. GRuG
    PubbuWuP ZiNk WattooM
    GaZoRK. CHuMBLE SpuZz.

    (This message has been edited by Lord Gwydion (edited 02-23-2002).)



  • Quote

    Originally posted by Lord Gwydion:
    < Various Gripes>

    (1) There is nothing wrong with that. I don't know of any web browser that dosen't recogize the formating.

    (2) It isn't intended to look like anything, it is a picture of metal, I think. I don't remember exactly, but it looks nice, in my opinion. I respect you're right to disagree.

    (3) They were. They were all either style prefrences or complaints about things the user will never see and take only a few miliseconds extra to load, if that.

    (4) The Page is about the Cytherian World!

    (5) Well, that seems reasonable enough.

    (6) Removing them would require work for no benifit other than a vain attempt to make you quit complaining. This would be a waste of time and chances are it would not work anyway.

    (7): A Microsoft seems to behave in an anti-Java way.
    (7): B Oh, quit complaining. You don't give a single reason why you perfer sever-side scripts, let alone why they are better. Please don't read this as a request for detailed explanation, I don't want any more comments from you on anything , least of all this page.
    (7): C It is used in a counter service that does page demographics.

    (8) Another style prefrence. Besides, it isn't a 'main' page as much as a 'welcome' page. And it should be html, you're right. I'd fix this, but some people probobly have it bookmarked already.

    In conclusion, if you (Gwdy) have anything else to say, I'm not interested.
    You can post it here, as is you're right, but I don't care. I'm not going to let a flame war start over 'style prefrences'. Goodbye.

    ------------------
    Ein weasel hat Sie Gehirn!

    Those online traslators just don't live up to the hype.



  • Ok, it looks like I'll have to personally comment to both of you.

    Your post is up first Gwydion, mostly because you posted first.

    Quote

    Originally posted by Lord Gwydion:
    Text originally posted by Bryce
    Text originally posted by Gwydion

    (1) There's nothing wrong with that.
    Yes there is. The <font> tag isn't an actual HTML tag.
    Its an old HTML tag, that was dropped in HTML 4.0 It still exists in older HTML documents and HTML 4.0 Transitional , personally I find it quite useful.

    (2) It isn't intended to look like stone. Perhaps you ought to support you're local lenscrafters, rather than waste your time making inflamitory statements.
    It most certainly looks exactly like a poor attempt to look like granite or somesuch. What is it intended to look like, then?
    Personally, it reminds me of a carpet. But if it isn't intended to look like anything, then oh well. I don't see how it looks like a two-year-old with a crayon, they're much more messy.

    I have no comment for #3

    (4) For crying out loud...
    I see absolutely no relevancy to the game Cythera, and yet the word 'Cythera' is pasted all over the entire site.
    Guilty as charged, though I suppose all of us have at some point done something here that's not Cythera related. I suppose its because the Cytherian Journal expands the original world of Cythera.

    (5) Okay, but this sounds like a style issue to me. I'll look into it, perhaps a tasteful background would be in order.
    The white background is fine, but there is just way too much area between the top bar and the title text and the main text -- if you just remove a few of the lines of whitespace it will look better.
    Hmm, I have a few mis-alignment errors, but I guess you're right Gwydion. It does seem like a lot of extra spaces in there. The white background is fine but the titles are a dreadful distance from the content below them. This just needs some fine tuning, Bryce, experiment around with it a bit.

    (6) From the GUI HTML editor I use for much of the work. Only people to have nothing better than to creep around in a page's HTML so as to think up technical-sounding things to whine about see it anyway.
    If you don't know what the tag does then you should take it out. It's silly to do otherwise, especially since no browsers will recognise the arguments/tags.
    Well, I'm thinking you might want to take out any tag you don't know the effects it will cause, there's probably a browser out there (one of the smaller ones) that will have weird results happen, almost certainly.

    (7) Uh, what are you, a Microsoft crone?
    Huh?
    Besides, the Javascript is used in a way that is not mission critical, if you disable Javascript you aren't going to miss out on much.
    JavaScript shouldn't be included in any good web page. The only scripting languages put on web pages, in my opinion, are server-side ones -- Perl, PHP, et cetera. And why do you have it on there in the first place?
    I think using JavaScript is a matter of preference...

    (8) Who Would want to go back to the 'Hello Newbie, if you're looking for CTGJ look here' screen? All it's functions are duplicated on the side bar, anyway.
    Having no link to the main page is simply very bad style -- the user has to instead type in 'index.htm' (it should by .html, by the way -- this isn't the ancient UNIX that doesn't allow file extensions longer than three characters, and /.Public/cythera/ will automatically go to index.html when you type in that URL) manually.
    I think first of all you should definately change it to .html because .htm is usually confusing to some people. Second, if you can't use a back button, then you probably do need a link. However , I do know a problem with caching pages that prevents a user from viewing pages in their history, so just to be on the safe side I guess there should be a link somewhere, maybe in a frame on the side or something.

    Quote

    Stuff originally posted by Bryce:
    Bryce's text is in bold

    (1) There is nothing wrong with that. I don't know of any web browser that dosen't recogize the formating.
    True, even iCab recognizes it, and that follows a strict HTML coding.

    (2) It isn't intended to look like anything, it is a picture of metal, I think. I don't remember exactly, but it looks nice, in my opinion. I respect you're right to disagree.
    Its a matter of preference really. I've developed a wide tolerance to many things, I don't mind it.

    (3) They were. They were all either style prefrences or complaints about things the user will never see and take only a few miliseconds extra to load, if that.
    Some of Gwydion's points were valid (more than one), but some were a tad nitpicky.

    (4) The Page is about the Cytherian World!
    ...from a certain point of view...and preference.

    (5) Well, that seems reasonable enough.
    See above.

    (6) Removing them would require work for no benifit other than a vain attempt to make you quit complaining. This would be a waste of time and chances are it would not work anyway.
    Don't make a habit of using tags you don't understand, sometimes they produce "odd" results...but I think those are fine, I've never seen them before either.

    (7): A Microsoft seems to behave in an anti-Java way.
    (7): B Oh, quit complaining. You don't give a single reason why you perfer sever-side scripts, let alone why they are better. Please don't read this as a request for detailed explanation, I don't want any more comments from you on anything, least of all this page.
    (7): C It is used in a counter service that does page demographics.

    Using Javascript is a matter of preference.

    (8) Another style prefrence. Besides, it isn't a 'main' page as much as a 'welcome' page. And it should be html, you're right. I'd fix this, but some people probobly have it bookmarked already.
    Yeah, fix the .html bit. As for the link, see above for the problems with caching.

    In conclusion, if you (Gwdy) have anything else to say, I'm not interested.
    You can post it here, as is you're right, but I don't care. I'm not going to let a flame war start over 'style prefrences'. Goodbye.

    Hmm...he did have a few valid points. Some of his ideas were helpful, however some of his statements we're a tad unnecessary. Yes, a few were a bit picky, perhaps that's his nature, or there's something else behind this. However, I can't stop having an uncanny feeling that your statement here was a tad harsh...

    Congratulations Gwydion, you finally forced me to read the CTGJ I've been ignoring. ;)

    ------------------
    "I'm a controversial figure. My friends either dislike me or hate me."

    (This message has been edited by Avatara (edited 02-23-2002).)

    (This message has been edited by Avatara (edited 02-24-2002).)



  • What's the problem? The site is fine! Great site! There is such as thing as constuctive criticism by for crying out loud you dont have to flame the guy about it. He obviously put a lot of work into it and yeah it needs touching up but its not bad.

    ------------------
    Ask not what your tiger can do for you...
    Ask what you can do for your tiger



  • To be a bit more constructive and a tad less scathing with gobs of flaming napalm:

    Posted Image

    The iCab error report. For the style issues:

    Take out (url="http://"http://www.damnsw.net/~campbell/whitespace_1.png")this whitespace(/url) between the dot and the 'metal' texture at the top. It should be the same distance between the dot and the text and between the dot and the 'metal' texture.

    And (url="http://"http://www.damnsw.net/~campbell/whitespace_2.png")this whitespace(/url). Put a dot between the two sets of smaller text and again, the space between the large text and the dot should be the same as between the small text and the dot.

    The navigation bar's image is really quite ugly, in my opinion. If you replace it with perhaps something that looks like gold with black lettering on it it might be better. Unfortunately, since I am hardly good at designing graphics, I can't help you there.

    ---

    As for the HTML content issues, I suggest you learn HTML -- it's really not that hard. And if you do bother with HTML, then you should also learn CSS -- which is really quite easy, but it does make your pages look much nicer. And you don't have to be using the silly <font> and <center> tags anymore -- nor will you have to do anything in HTML like that -- if you use CSS. If you decide to learn HTML and possibly CSS, then you can find a good HTML cheat sheet -- from which I learned nearly all of the HTML I now know -- at (url="http://"http://www.webmonkey.com/")webmonkey.com(/url) at the HTML cheat sheet link. For CSS, you can learn it from (url="http://"http://www.w3c.org/")w3c.org(/url) -- click on the CSS link and then you can just wander about from there and try to find a good tutorial. Or you can just look at the sources to pages -- (url="http://"http://www.damnsw.net/~campbell/")my website(/url) is pretty simple in HTML and the stylesheet (CSS stands for Cascading Style Sheets) is (url="http://"http://www.damnsw.net/~campbell/stylesheet.css")here(/url). You should probably also have the (url="http://"http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-CSS1")CSS Level 1(/url) reference guide bookmarked if you want to learn CSS.

    Oh, and I'd really suggest putting more Cythera-related content in there; I really see absolutely no relevancy to the game Cythera on that site.

    <edit: Grrrr...the whitespace images wouldn't display. I had to take the screenshots over again and then edit the messages that came with them. And both of them went through PhotoShop...so did another png I made that wouldn't display...>

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    YakKa Foob MoG. GRuG
    PubbuWuP ZiNk WattooM
    GaZoRK. CHuMBLE SpuZz.

    (This message has been edited by Lord Gwydion (edited 02-24-2002).)



  • Gwy, why are you nitpicking so much? The site is nice. And a work inprogress. Bryce didn't have to make it. He made it for fun and as a resource.
    On another note, don't you find it a bit ironic that your only coming on the boards to give criticism? You've manged to mangled up the point of the boards badly. The boards are here so we can have fun. Yes, Gwy, FUN. Yes, also to help other people, but the main points stands. Instead, your turning the boards in a place to release your frustrations. No web site is perfect and you just have to deal with that fact. Life isn't perfect either. While you pointed out what was wrong about his site, you never, not even once said that it was nice, or good job or anything of the sort. Nothing will come of just seeing the bad things. Instead, you make the other person feel bad and not want to try again. Next time, remember the point of the boards before posting.

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    How do men with beards play the flute?
    When I'm bored, my post number goes up.



  • I will take into consideration the many points presented by various people in the next update.

    Things that won't change -
    Control Bar image
    Use of <font> tag
    Content (Gwdy Gripe # 4)

    Gwdy - thanks for you're well ment advice, but try to be less negitive next time you have the chance to give someone advice.

    Thanks, Bryce

    ------------------
    Ein weasel hat Sie Gehirn!

    Those online traslators just don't live up to the hype.



  • Quote

    Originally posted by idiotSavant:
    He made it for fun and as a resource.
    As a resource? For what? It has no relevancy to Cythera. It's as relevant to Cythera as the movie '2001: A Space Odyssey' is to the year 2001.

    On another note, don't you find it a bit ironic that your only coming on the boards to give criticism? You've manged to mangled up the point of the boards badly.
    I only posted because I like to see web pages that conform to proper HTML. I've said this once before: had I the ability to do so I'd ban myself from these forums.

    The boards are here so we can have fun. Yes, Gwy, FUN. Yes, also to help other people, but the main points stands. Instead, your turning the boards in a place to release your frustrations.
    You're starting to sound like a bad psychologist...

    No web site is perfect and you just have to deal with that fact.
    In style, perhaps not. But with correct HTML, mine is -- have you seen any problems with it in the iCab error report? iCab doesn't even find a lack of a <!DOCTYPE> tag. There are no <font> or <center> tags in my website. There are no 'X-CLARIS-WHATEVER' tags. The HTML and CSS is actually perfect. You can verify this yourself by looking at it in iCab. It makes iCab smile. Heck, even my CGI-generated version of the website (I only have a local copy, so you can't see it) is perfectly HTML 4.0 compliant.

    While you pointed out what was wrong about his site, you never, not even once said that it was nice, or good job or anything of the sort. Nothing will come of just seeing the bad things. Instead, you make the other person feel bad and not want to try again.
    I don't care what the content of the website of, and the HTML was quite simply awful. So therefore I don't have anything to say about the fact that it was a 'nice' page, but I can help him with the HTML. Which I think would help him make better web pages.

    Next time, remember the point of the boards before posting.
    The point of the boards? He asked specifically:

    Originally posted by Bryce:
    (b)Let me know what you think.(/b)
    

    What I thought was that the HTML of the page was bad -- which is precisely what he asked for. I don't care about the content, but I couldn't resist pointing out that his HTML needed work. Perhaps I'm a bloody fool. But I'm not going to change, regardless of how much you pester me.

    <edit: Grrr. Bloody typos.>

    ------------------
    YakKa Foob MoG. GRuG
    PubbuWuP ZiNk WattooM
    GaZoRK. CHuMBLE SpuZz.

    (This message has been edited by Lord Gwydion (edited 02-24-2002).)



  • I guess if Bryce added added the <!doctype> tag specifying he uses HTML 4.0 Transitional most of those errors wouldn't be there. HTML 4.0 Transitional accepts
    <FONT> and <CENTER> tags, which in some cases are more conveniant to use than CSS.

    ------------------
    "I'm a controversial figure. My friends either dislike me or hate me."

    (This message has been edited by Avatara (edited 02-24-2002).)



  • resists flaming gwdy to a burnt out little cinder

    I asked for comments on the user end of the site, not the HTML.

    And I stand by what Ody said, it may not be great psychology, but he seems to be right.

    ------------------
    Ein weasel hat Sie Gehirn!

    Those online traslators just don't live up to the hype.



  • I didn't even bother reading the last part. This is pointless, and people are just getting annoyed...Can this topic please be locked before situations become worse?

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    Fee, fi, fo, fum, I smell the blood of an Englishmuffin.



  • Quote

    Originally posted by iKaterei:
    **< snip>
    **

    Indeed, topic lock would be good.
    Thanks,
    Bryce

    ------------------
    I'll just put a random number at 0008EC and see what happens.
    (Famous Last Words #-32767)

    Where do you want to (url="http://"http://www.macclassics.com/cythera/tricks/rJade.htm")teleport(/url) today?


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