Omen again



  • Has he been under our noses all along??

    So I was transcribing Omen’s monologues/preaches, and noticed that he identifies the room at the end of the test as “his quarters.” Does this mean that Omen lives in Cademia? :o This would fit in nicely with the Opheltius murder, since it wouldn’t make much sense for Pelagon to travel all the way from Kosha, kill Opheltius, and leave. I was trying to think of who seems a little suspicious in Cademia, and no one came to mind, but there are a lot of people there so… I think one of the notes in the test said something about Omen appearing as a vision at a great cost to his physical form, which would kind of disprove this theory, but it still might be worthwhile. :p



  • Thanks for transcribing Omen's rants! ^_ ****^

    I've transcribed the scrolls in the Omen's Test, and none of them say anything like that...

    Welcome, Human, to my little test for you. It is not hard to pass, and will give you some of the skills you need to survive (though you may feel like a creature in a cage). I hope that Omen did not startle you. His appearance is strange, but don't let that deceive you.
    You have already passed the first part of the test - you have read this note. Next, you must pull that nearby lever to open the gate, leading you to the next room. There you will find a locked trapdoor. Find the key, open it, and then go down the ladder.

    Sorry, the key is not in this chest, but good try. Look to your south - notice anything interesting about the wall? Try using it...
    Oh, you might want to use one of the torches in this chest, it will provide some light for you if you wield it in your hands...

    Ah, very good, very observant, finding that second secret door, but not all discoveries like this lead to reward, unfortunately. However, this one does...

    This room is trickier - the door is locked by a spell. You have but one chance to get this one open - take that strange looking object, what you would call a bomb. Pick it up, use it to light it, and then toss it so it lands right next to the door. Stand back and let time pass...

    Not all levers are easily found - perhaps if you re-arranged things a bit here.... (don't worry - all the crates are empty so it is easy for you to move them, and you don't need to waste your time searching them!)

    Anyhow, I like your theory that Omen is the murderer. I recall Sely thought it unlikely that his master would bother doing the dirty work. The only thing is, if Omen can shape-shift, why does he let you see that ugly form? Haha.



  • @breadworldmercy453_bot, on 25 February 2011 - 10:37 AM, said in Omen again:

    Anyhow, I like your theory that Omen is the murderer. I recall Sely thought it unlikely that his master would bother doing the dirty work. The only thing is, if Omen can shape-shift, why does he let you see that ugly form? Haha.

    Heh, I thought that was odd too, but the text when you give the crolna to Pelagon clearly shows Omen shapeshifting into Magpie. Maybe he’s just too lazy? :p

    Also, nice work on transcribing the scrolls. :)

    This post has been edited by Buzzzzy : 25 February 2011 - 11:01 AM



  • I thought it was obvious that spot was Omen's quarters. :blink:

    Also, I hadn't realized the Undine could become visions.



  • @two-jacks_bot, on 25 February 2011 - 02:20 PM, said in Omen again:

    Also, I hadn't realized the Undine could become visions.

    That actually is weird how Omen can do that, I think there was some speculation about UrSylph being able to as well, but Omen is the only character who does that in-game, except perhaps Magpie at the end. I’m not sure if it’s an Undine attribute or just weird magic.



  • I thought it was an Undine thing, since Jinrai's ghost does it too.



  • I'm not sure that Omen actually lives below Cademia, since he never seems to be in his quarters. Perhaps, he just maintains the room to deceive the hero as to Omen's nature (i.e. that he is not human in the least) or as an occasional base of operations? Of course, it is possible he is there but simply does not allow you to notice him...

    I do agree that it is a distinct possibility that he might have killed Opheltius himself, although I think the game is meant to suggest Pelagon actually did travel to Cademia for that purpose.



  • "Welcome, Human, to my little test for you. It is not hard to pass, and will give you some of the skills you need to survive (though you may feel like a creature in a cage). I hope that Omen did not startle you. His appearance is strange, but don't let that deceive you. "

    Who wrote this scroll? Probably Omen's master. But who would that be? Is he the one you kill when you purify the crolna?

    Also, I think Pelagon really is the murderer. Why? Because he travels through the sea. Stentor saw him in Cademia (and I want to recall him saying he was dripping, but I might be mistaken), and Stentor is always standing by the sea, so that would probably be how he saw Pelagon. Someone came out of the sea to plant the crolna in the fountain in Catamarca (ever noticed the hidden tunnel between the sea and the spring?). Someone came out of the sea to kill Antiphus (he was drowned and was covered in kelp).

    I think Pelagon is behind all of these acts.

    This post has been edited by Seldane : 26 February 2011 - 04:36 AM



  • Unless I'm missing a prompt, Stentor didn't mention if Pelagon was dripping. But I do agree that he would travel by sea.

    I consider it proven that fake-Pelagon is Omen's master, though maybe some still disagree with that. I'm not sure, however, if he was the one to murder Opheltius. It could maybe have been Omen or another Undine. I don't think it really matters though.



  • Killing Opheltius seems like a rather dangerous deed for such an important figure to attempt. I think we can assume that all undine travel by sea, thus it could really be any undine who did all those things. I don’t recall Stentor's account either, although if he did that would indeed strongly indicate that Pelagon was the murderer. Also, there are either very few undine and Omen was lying about their agents being all over, or Omen is in a relatively high position of power (or at least a very close servant of Pelagon’s), seeing as Pelagon and Omen were the ones who take Alaric and Magpie’s forms in the very bad ending (giving the crolna shard to Pelagon in the grotto).



  • I just think it seems unlikely that anybody other than Pelagon killed Opheltius. Because if another undine did it, why would that undine first have the shape of Pelagon upon entering Cademia (becuse again, Stentor did see him)?

    Also, the thing about Pelagon being Omen's master, yes it does sound likely, but I still do not firmly believe it. Why? If you re-enter the grotto when you have the four shards, Pelagon is still there. How can he be in the shard and in the grotto? Granted, this may be a bug, because when you enter it again, Pelagon still moves up to you, and brings up a dialogue, except this time he does not have anything to say.

    Another thing that bothers me is that the Seldane seems to know that the crolna is tainted. But how can it be tainted (by Pelagon) while he is still moving around in the world? I think it would seem more likely if another undine has been tainting it all along.

    This post has been edited by Seldane : 27 February 2011 - 04:24 AM



  • @seldane_bot, on 27 February 2011 - 04:20 AM, said in Omen again:

    Also, the thing about Pelagon being Omen's master, yes it does sound likely, but I still do not firmly believe it. Why? If you re-enter the grotto when you have the four shards, Pelagon is still there. How can he be in the shard and in the grotto? Granted, this may be a bug, because when you enter it again, Pelagon still moves up to you, and brings up a dialogue, except this time he does not have anything to say.

    I always assumed this was a bug, since Pelagon disappears after giving you the crolna, only reappearing when you go back to the grotto. I think the game was meant to strongly imply that Pelagon is Omen’s master, given the bad ending where Pelagon takes Alaric’s form, however it is still quite possible it could be someone else.

    @seldane_bot, on 27 February 2011 - 04:20 AM, said in Omen again:

    Another thing that bothers me is that the Seldane seems to know that the crolna is tainted. But how can it be tainted (by Pelagon) while he is still moving around in the world? I think it would seem more likely if another undine has been tainting it all along.

    IIRC Sabinate only warns you about the corruption after you’ve gotten the fourth shard, which is after Pelagon disappears (not counting his reappearing when you re-enter the grotto). The reason I always assumed Pelagon tainted the crolna is that when you use the unpurified crolna on Alaric, Pelagon replaces Alaric, which would be a bit strange if he wasn’t in the crolna.

    I’ll have to dig through my old savefiles and see if I have any around the murder time, or else just start a new game and get to that point, as I don’t recall the Stentor dialogue, but you’re probably right, which would indeed strongly imply that Pelagon is the killer. This still strikes me as odd, though, as even if he isn’t Omen’s master, he’s of a high enough rank that the undine evidently trusted him in taking Alaric’s form. It’s also weird how he would arrive in the form of Pelagon rather than some other, less suspicious form, but that may be just so the game has a way of indicating it’s him.



  • I"d never thought much about who tainted the crolna, but I hadn't really thought of it as being Pelagon. I thought that the crolna had been "tainted" ever since it had been in the hands of the Undine. Isn't that how the Undine corrupted Maayti and drove away the Seldane? And caused the plague in Catamarca?



  • My theory is that they can only truly become people that are dead. And when they have, they are stuck in that form until they are truly determined to take another. All other shape shifts are temporary - they can only be held for a short time.

    It is also what happens in the game. He only becomes Halos for a short time and he only becomes Magpie for a short time.

    At a later time, when killing Alaric, he was truly determined to become him.

    What the Wizard says is exactly what I meant: I always assumed the crolna had been tainted by the undine for a very long time. And that whoever tainted it was inside it. That is what the seldane speak about, that the crolna was the cause of corruption or something such. I don't remember exactly.

    This post has been edited by Seldane : 28 February 2011 - 03:45 AM



  • I had always thought that the corruption that caused those events and the corruption that totally freaks Sabinate out were separate things, but Seldane’s theorys make sense as well, so I dunno. This is sounding an awful lot like horcruxes from Harry Potter… :p

    This post has been edited by Buzzzzy : 28 February 2011 - 04:20 AM



  • I've never read/seen that, so I wouldn't know.



  • Omen's master cannot be in four places at once, at least, not as far as I know. Here's a quote from Sabinate:
    "For 120 eternities, ours was Maayti, city of Truth, until our enemy drove us forth. A Crolna shard, such as you bear, but larger, was turned to evil, and abide with corruption we could not. Sealed it within, we did, less corruption spread... By your band have you removed the corruption of a Crolna part. We would that you did the same."
    To me, this implies that the shard under Catamarca as well as the shard in Maayti were corrupted by Omen's master - he was not inside of them, but he had corrupted them with his powers nonetheless. When you pick up these shards, you feel sick for a second, and then it passes. I think that merely by holding the shards, you drive out the corruption.

    Then, when fake-Pelagon gives you the final shard: "Pelagon hands you the fourth shard, and then fades away like mist before the wind." I think that implies that he went into the shard. If instead, you surrender to him the first three shards, he and Omen take over LKH, and Omen calls him master. This is why I am confident that fake-Pelagon is Omen's master.

    When you approach Sabinate with the full Crolna, he freaks out and says you bear the essence of corruption. Fake-Pelagon, I believe, is the essence of corruption. He corrupted two of the shards previously, and he himself is the essence of corruption that Sabinate warns you of.

    If you purify the Crolna, Omen goes on and on about how you've destroyed his master, proving (unless he's lying) that his master was in the Crolna.



  • @breadworldmercy453_bot, on 25 February 2011 - 10:37 AM, said in Omen again:

    Anyhow, I like your theory that Omen is the murderer. I recall Sely thought it unlikely that his master would bother doing the dirty work. The only thing is, if Omen can shape-shift, why does he let you see that ugly form? Haha.

    I'm a bit late on this part but I personally think Omen's pretty cool looking
    he's probably my favorite character due to his neat-looking-ness and mysterious-ness

    he's that wicked shady character you kind wanna trust



  • I think Pelagon is definitely the murderer of Opheltius and there seems to be a large amount of evidence indicating that he is Omen's master. Personally, I think it's very strange that such a being would do most of the work (especially assuming Pelagon's form) himself rather than having his subordinates do it for him, but I suppose that might just be his style of leadership.

    I think that the Crolna was tainted a long time ago, but I don't think that necessarily means that an Undine was inside it the whole time. The possession of the Crolna at the end of the game was, I think, purely to get at Alaric rather than a regular occurrence.



  • I'm shocked, but I entirely agree with Sely O.O


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